Episode 21: Madeleine Glassford - The Space Between

Two ADDYs. A Gold Award. Summa cum laude. And right now, working retail at a stationery shop while the design industry figures out what to do with her.

This week, Quinn and Naila sit with Madeleine Glassford — a December 2025 BFA graduate from Flagler College — in the gap between what design school rewards and what hiring actually selects for. We talk about why beautifully designed resumes are getting killed by ATS software before a human ever sees them, what it actually means to have range in a market that wants specialists, and what Quinn honestly thinks when she sees a portfolio this multidisciplinary land on her desk.

Plus: Australian coastal and Aboriginal-inspired design making its way into American feeds, Pakistan's truck art tradition, and what Madeleine wants her career to look like in ten years — spoiler, she's not waiting for someone to hand it to her.

Guest: Madeleine Glassford | madeleineglassford.com | @madeleine.glassford on Instagram and LinkedIn

Chapters
0:00 Welcome + Opening Question
3:00 Around the Room
8:00 Guest Introduction
8:30 NOW — The Resume That Should Have Worked
21:49 NEAR — What Are We Actually Hiring For
40:32 Across the Pond — Design Without a Passport
47:22 FUTURE — The Industry Catches Up (Or Doesn't)
52:15 The Quinntessential Close
54:23 The Wrap

Find us at nownearfuture.com | @nownearfuture
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Transcript

Quinn Harrington (00:05.853)
Remind myself to stop hitting the desk.

Quinn Harrington (00:10.473)
Welcome to Now Near in the Future. I'm Quinn Harrington.

Naila Mir (00:14.786)
I'm Naila Mir, today's bye.

Quinn Harrington (00:15.987)
Hey, hey, let's start over again.

Naila Mir (00:22.264)
You want the music? Alright.

Quinn Harrington (00:23.399)
Yes. I'm gonna kick on our our bumper music. Welcome to Now, Mir and the Future. With Nyla Mir and Quinn Harrington. A podcast that's part crystal ball, part microscope, and part rocket ship.

Naila Mir (00:27.683)
Go on.

Quinn Harrington (00:55.603)
Welcome to Now Near in the Future. I'm Quinn Harrington.

Naila Mir (00:59.52)
and I'm Naila Mu. Today's guest graduated, and you're going to tell me if I say this wrong, graduated Summa Cum Laude, five, yeah, five months, Summa Cum Laude, five months ago with a gold award, two student silver Addis, and a thesis project that solved a problem nobody asked her to solve.

Madeleine Glassford (01:09.215)
There, yeah. There are yeah.

Quinn Harrington (01:10.695)
Summa cam Ladi.

Quinn Harrington (01:23.411)
And right now she's working at a stationary shop while the industry decides what to do with her. We're gonna spend the next hour in this gap.

Naila Mir (01:32.438)
Madeline Glassford welcome Excited to have you here on our podcast We'll do a proper introduction in a few minutes. But first one honest question If someone you just met tonight asked what you do, what do you actually say right now?

Madeleine Glassford (01:35.123)
Mm-hmm. Thank you.

Madeleine Glassford (01:53.505)
I'm a multidisciplinary designer. I have a background in illustration, photography, graphic design, and I'm a Swiss Army knife in any sort of room you need me to be in.

Naila Mir (02:09.069)
Okay, and what are you passionate about? The most passionate about?

Madeleine Glassford (02:15.716)
out of those I would definitely say graphic design is my passion. That is what I got my degree in and I'm excited to enter the industry.

Naila Mir (02:26.391)
Queen.

Quinn Harrington (02:27.189)
Wonderful. Well, let's go around the room. Around the room. Before we go deeper, let's go around the room. What's on everyone's mind that has nothing to do with a job title? I'll kick off. So Nilo's gonna be a little bit mad, but I you know, it's America's two hundred and fiftieth anniversary is coming up, so I've been boning up on my American history and

the American Revolution when we kicked the Brits butts and sent home packing. So welcome, Nyla.

Naila Mir (03:01.997)
Good to know you, Quinn. What have I been up to? You know what's been keeping us up in England? Well, pretty much everywhere is World Cup, which is happening in America and Canada and Mexico. US wasn't doing too bad, I think, recently. So that's what's keeping me busy outside of work.

Quinn Harrington (03:05.951)
Mm-hmm.

Quinn Harrington (03:23.049)
Yeah, we won two games, lost one, and the next one is the is the Biggie. And there's a small percentage of a chance that America might play against Great Britain and Philadelphia on July fourth, which is our independence day. So how crazy would that be?

Naila Mir (03:41.709)
how, how, my god, we're gonna be an opposite size. This is gonna be fun. Yep. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Quinn Harrington (03:48.627)
Yeah, you'll actually have a chance of winning this time. So unlike the American Revolution, we're getting better as a s as a soccer country, but we're not there yet.

Naila Mir (03:55.18)
Hahaha

We'll see, we'll see, we'll be on WhatsApp together. What about you? Madeline?

Quinn Harrington (04:01.629)
Yes, we will.

Madeleine Glassford (04:04.726)
before July fourth I have my grandpa's eighty seventh birthday is this weekend. So we have a bunch of family flying in and we'll have a big celebration for him.

Naila Mir (04:14.689)
How nice, did you do all the design stuff for the birthday, like invites and all?

Quinn Harrington (04:15.037)
That's wonderful.

Madeleine Glassford (04:21.306)
my family's a lot more casual so it was more of a text, everyone's invited.

Naila Mir (04:24.117)
Okay. All right.

Quinn Harrington (04:29.289)
Awesome. And how old does grandpa turn? Eighty-seven. my gosh. That's that's amazing. We all get i excited when you know they they make it another year and you're always like, I hope this is not the last year with them. So happy birthday, grandpa, in in the future.

Madeleine Glassford (04:33.416)
Eighty seven. Mm-hmm.

Naila Mir (04:39.191)
Big milestones.

Madeleine Glassford (04:47.868)
Mm. I'm yeah. I'm very lucky. My grandparents live like ten minutes away. So I get to see them pretty regularly.

Naila Mir (04:47.949)
Yeah.

Quinn Harrington (04:54.143)
Wow.

Yeah.

Naila Mir (04:57.178)
that's sweet. And you make an effort. Yep.

Quinn Harrington (04:59.635)
Wonderful.

Madeleine Glassford (05:02.824)
I do, I do. We exchange puzzles, we we'll go shopping. My grandma loves IKEA, so we'll pop around there.

Naila Mir (05:04.255)
Yeah.

Naila Mir (05:10.537)
That's fun.

Quinn Harrington (05:14.729)
Yeah, IKEA is like it's like my favorite place and my least favorite place. 'Cause you can't just pop in for a quick trip, you know. You gotta g go and get lost and you know, wander around and wonder how you ended up in bedding again. You're like, this place

Naila Mir (05:25.773)
Yeah.

Naila Mir (05:34.753)
Yeah, yeah, it's staged like that. Madeleine would know about staging, right? So, yeah.

Quinn Harrington (05:38.181)
It is. Yes. Absolutely. Definitely sounds like a like a Nielsen thing. okay, well, let's move along here. perfect time to properly introduce our guest. Madeline Glassford graduated from Flagla College in December 2025. Similum Lottie. well done. With a BFA in graphic design, a track that requires a year-long, actually six-month independent thesis.

Naila Mir (05:45.421)
you

Madeleine Glassford (05:59.637)
Thank you.

Quinn Harrington (06:06.778)
And a public defense on top of the standard coursework. She left with a gold award from her senior portfolio show. Again, well done, no easy task. Student silver at Student Silver Addies and a body of work that spans branding, illustration, photography, pat packaging, and a seven minute silent film, plus a decade of theater and stage management before she ever opened a design program.

Naila Mir (06:31.925)
Right, and you also served on AAF Jacksonville board as a social media chair. What is AAF?

Madeleine Glassford (06:41.29)
That's the American Advertising Federation. So it's a nationwide organization and they are known for putting on the Addies, which is a really big gallus celebrating advertising achievements.

Naila Mir (06:54.109)
Excellent. And you also interned at Future Friends, we may talk about that, a working branding studio in St. Augustine and led an Omega database build for a digital humanities grant project that put you in the rooms with museum creators. So much experience going on here. Your branding, her branding for the St. Augustine Lighthouse and Maritime Museum, designed in a college classroom, is still in use today.

Madeleine Glassford (07:00.298)
Mm-hmm.

Madeleine Glassford (07:23.136)
Mm-hmm.

Naila Mir (07:24.683)
That is amazing. Yeah.

Quinn Harrington (07:24.862)
Very cool.

Well, where can we find you on the internets and social?

Madeleine Glassford (07:31.607)
p my website is MadelineGlassford dot com, I'm Madeline Glassford on LinkedIn, I'm Madeline.glassford on Instagram. It's my name everywhere.

Quinn Harrington (07:41.397)
Wow, that's great. Well you have a unique name, so you know, my mine was a little bit harder to secure. so well done there. And if you're looking for now near in the future, we are now near future everywhere. Now on TikTok.

Madeleine Glassford (07:44.522)
Thank you, yeah.

Naila Mir (07:50.797)
Mm-hmm

Naila Mir (07:57.791)
yeah? We are.

Quinn Harrington (08:03.208)
We are. okay, let's let's dive into the now segment. Now. The resume that should have worked. I want to start with the thing that doesn't add up on paper. You did everything during design school, asks of a serious student, the BFA track, thesis, addies, the board seat, the internship, and five months later, is that correct? Since you graduated?

Madeleine Glassford (08:27.858)
If I graduated in December.

Quinn Harrington (08:29.778)
Okay. you're working retail while waiting for a full time seat to open, finding your your first major role. I sat in on your thesis review and I was really impressed by your level of thinking and ability to kind of put together a a concept and a a business plan for a tool that we didn't even know we needed.

so I know what that record r actually represents. So I wanna ask you directly, what do you think what did you think was going to happen when you graduated and what has actually happened since then?

Madeleine Glassford (09:13.016)
I did have a guess it would take about this long to have a job and find a full time position, just 'cause the industry there are so many graduates in graphic design. like I recently applied to a design apprenticeship that was made for recently graduated students and I saw that the person who held the position before was a

Quinn Harrington (09:19.326)
Mm-hmm.

Madeleine Glassford (09:42.656)
product designer at Apple, I was like, my goodness, this is not a recent graduate holding this position. And I do keep finding situations where it's a position will require like three to five years of experience, but then the person who held it before me had seven years of experience and they had held higher positions and they downgraded their level to have that position. So I do think

Quinn Harrington (09:44.788)
Mm-hmm.

Madeleine Glassford (10:12.217)
So far that is something that I didn't suspect. People having such hard time kind of going from one level and going up. I didn't really see how it would be just not linear at all.

Quinn Harrington (10:34.642)
Yeah, it does typically take about six months to secure that first entry level role. And a lot of positions do ask for at least a few years of experience. So there's that that gap there where it's like, how do I get to three three to five years of experience unless it's at a place where, you know, I would rather not be working. my

role situation was a little bit unique. So kind of like you, well, really only in my last semester did I finally make Dean's list. I won the AIGA portfolio poster concept. we weren't really grading flagular college portfolios back then. So we didn't really have like a competition per se. but essentially I was recruited right out of school.

for a small design firm and then got recruited to Saint John Partners within about like four to six months afterwards. So that's a pretty unique situation. And frankly, your credentials and your talent is far far exceeded mine at the time. Like I was just kind of like I don't know, I felt like I was like an average designer. There are definitely people who had better books than mine.

but I advise you to hang in there. something will come along and you might have to be willing to move.

Naila Mir (12:07.479)
Yeah.

Madeleine Glassford (12:11.687)
I'm okay with that. I've been applying all of America. I will move to a different state.

Quinn Harrington (12:15.527)
Mm-hmm.

Naila Mir (12:18.549)
Are you looking for a particular, like you're in the industry, right? But are you looking at particular types of companies to work with? So one is you can go for a design studio, right? But there are other avenues. What are you really looking at in terms of job searching?

Quinn Harrington (12:18.589)
Yeah.

Madeleine Glassford (12:35.727)
I think the most important thing for me is mentorship. I know that education and learning doesn't stop once you've graduated. So I'm looking for a company that has some sort of team or an agency that has people working above me that I can really absorb and learn from and sponge up all that information that I can and help.

Guide me to be an even better designer and a better asset to the business.

Naila Mir (13:08.897)
Yeah, because you know what I was thinking like Quinn, because I have never worked on the agency side. Yes, I've got my own company and I partner with different organisations to do internal comms and then we partner with design agencies. But some of these companies have in-house design functions and that's another opportunity or avenue that you look at, right? Because they have these in-built studios in the company. So yeah, there's opportunities and networking is key, as we know.

Yeah.

Quinn Harrington (13:40.493)
so your portfolio, like we said, moves across branding and multiple disciplines. was that a deliberate choice or just what happened when you followed your heart? What interested you?

Madeleine Glassford (13:55.166)
I do think it was a deliberate choice because I wanted to follow my heart. for example, I have a project that I won the two Addies for and it's branding for an all gluten-free restaurant. And I was fortunate enough to be able to use my own photography in some of those images and those were the images that won the award. So it was really amazing for me.

when I was able to submit and that one that every single element of that was something that I created and I love to look at those design crossroads because using all the talents in one project just helps it seem more cohesive and that's what I'm hoping for.

Quinn Harrington (14:43.879)
Makes total sense. so your thesis might be the clearest proof of how you think. You found a gap in a tool you use every day and designed a solution no one asked for. What does that say about the kind of designer you actually are versus the kind of job postings describe?

Madeleine Glassford (15:04.583)
I really do enjoy liking to solve problems. Design is a way of communication and communication is a way to solve problems. When I'm applying for junior designer positions, that's not necessarily something they're always looking for, but for me the answer is looking at the question why when designing, and finding

Just problems like you said that people maybe don't know that they have and that's another way to just keep adding to a position.

Quinn Harrington (15:44.318)
Yeah, you know, it's interesting. you know, when I got recruited by the the the big a the little agency, like I dove right into to doing work on regular significant projects. But when I went to the big agency, they essentially they put me on account an account that involved a lot of like, you know, cutting, you know

presentation boards and mounting stuff up and you know basically kind of like grunt work and you know that included doing like black and white ads for, you know, Accuview contact lenses and you know, it was really it's not very sexy or glamorous for that first six months or a year. but yeah, I just encourage you to keep an open mind. There's like Nyla was saying, there's so many different areas

of design, everything from like, you know, working at a magazine to working in house, working at a printer, working for, you know, a web development company. And you have like a broad range of skills. So I feel like you would be valuable and if you know we didn't have a producer Rachel on the call right now would say, send me your resume. Just just kidding Rachel. Just kidding.

Naila Mir (17:09.515)
Ha ha ha ha!

Madeleine Glassford (17:09.926)
I

Naila Mir (17:13.325)
No, but on a separate note, please do because I might want to look at it and we're going to come to these points as well because did I read you also to solve problems you need to have UX design experience, right? The user experience stuff and that's highly useful even in the comms industry. So yeah, please send your CV.

Quinn Harrington (17:14.056)
Madeleine Glassford (17:14.302)
Still send it.

Madeleine Glassford (17:32.946)
I will, I will not miss an opportunity, you both will be receiving it today.

Naila Mir (17:35.477)
Okay, good.

Quinn Harrington (17:40.427)
okay, so I wanna answer my own question here too, because I'm on the other side of this. When I see a portfolio with this much range, here's what I actually think.

you would be particularly suited towards a smaller agency or an in-house department because you have such a wide range of of skills. like I said when you when you end up at a at a bigger agency, you tend to get put on a single account doing similar tasks over and over again.

So maybe you're doing ads or you're doing website maintenance or you know, working on workflow automation. So there's not a lot of breadth of experience and not a lot of need. You know, it's like, okay, so it's great that you're a photographer, but we typically hire photographers. it's great that you're an illustrator, but

How often do we need illustration and do we need your particular style for every project? So I would probably recommend that you would look in that arena. Like for example, when your your classmate Rachel came to me, what was most appealing to me is that she was pretty decent at video, like a lot better than I I expected.

Like I thought I was gonna have to teach her a bunch of stuff and she kept telling me, she's Yeah, I know how to do that. Yeah, okay, yeah, I can do that. And I was like, Well, fine, I'm not gonna teach you anything else then. But also she was she's she was a good designer, but an even better strategist. And so that was that that sort of three pronged skill set is extremely valuable for a smaller company like mine or Nyla's.

Quinn Harrington (19:52.327)
We're we're both although we do different things, we're both very structured similarly. We've got a you know, ha handful like a small little dream team. And so when you find someone like you come along, Madeline, that can wear a lot of hats, it's extremely valuable to us.

Naila Mir (20:13.303)
Yeah, exactly. So broadening the horizons in this day and world, and we might talk about this in the next segments, is international. So seeing opportunities that can happen while you're sitting in America but working for a global organization or, know, everything's remote and agile now. across the pond moment. Yeah.

Madeleine Glassford (20:14.194)
Thank you, you're making me blush.

Quinn Harrington (20:36.586)
absolute. Absolutely. we just produced a a a series of videos for Nielsen IQ when they were getting ready for their IPO. that's their initial public offering. And we interviewed people in the UK, we interviewed people in like Estonia, South America, and a couple other countries, California,

So yeah, and they all work for the same company. working on, you know, and it's not like they were native to a particular, you know, region. You know, they were just on a team on a a multinational team. So, you know, don't don't limit yourself to just the good old USA. shall we move to the near segment, Nyla?

Naila Mir (21:33.421)
Yeah, we can do that. What are we actually hiring for? Oh, okay.

Quinn Harrington (21:39.212)
well let me press the button. Near

Naila Mir (21:49.42)
It's about the hiring problem and it's not just a Madeleine problem, right? So if we take a step back, we think there's a hiring problem. So where from, I'm trying to make this a bit easier to talk about. So from where you sit Madeleine and keeping in mind culture and people and the hiring process. So what does a hiring process actually select for when it screens a portfolio like yours?

So we talked about this a bit, right? So from your opinion, when you're talking about hiring, what are those things you're seeing that they're looking at and they're not looking at when it comes to your CV or your skills or your expertise?

Madeleine Glassford (22:33.872)
Mm-hmm. I can see that one thing I'm doing a lot of is actually videoing myself. They're asking for me to complete various one minute, two-minute videos and it varies. Sometimes they want a really cinematic, highly edited masterpiece, and other times they want one shot, no edit.

Naila Mir (22:45.303)
Mm-hmm.

Madeleine Glassford (23:03.592)
Very simple. And then the other thing is trying to make sure that the company actually sees your resume and it doesn't get filtered out by AI before they even get the chance to see your work. I had a friend who was using this beautifully designed resume and she had so much experience and she wasn't really getting far in the inter interview process.

Then she recently switched to actually the Harvard template for resume, which is very simple black and white kind of blocky text. And that week she got a bunch of responses. So also making sure that your resume is AI compatible as each company even uses different programs and has different levels of accuracy, just trying to make it so an actual human sees your work and your work gets far enough.

Naila Mir (23:42.061)
Mm-hmm.

Quinn Harrington (24:02.162)
Yeah, that's totally true. So my friend Chris, Olberding, he owned a a pretty big design agency. And so when he was applying for jobs, he would send over his resume and I'm like, God, this thing is hideous. He's like, I know, but designed resumes don't work. Like, you gotta use this template, you know, these

this particular font or you'll never even get a call back because the AI will reject it. Like don't put your picture on there, don't do a logo, don't do any of that stuff. Just send over a boring ass black and white resume and that's what will hopefully get you a call back.

Naila Mir (24:48.257)
That is so weird. When I was doing CVs, there was no AI. It was a human looking at it. So we didn't have to worry about those things. But we did worry about how do we break through. And I always go back to my thing about, in my life, I have never really interviewed. It's always been through networks. And people have seen me or talked to me or then seen my work through people.

Quinn Harrington (24:50.202)
I know.

Naila Mir (25:13.623)
So I luckily haven't really been through an interview, but the ones that I have, haven't been, I haven't got from far. In your experience, when you do an interview, what are those questions or moments where you feel, I'm being myself, but I think they're putting me in a box? Have you felt that in your experience of interviews?

Madeleine Glassford (25:33.348)
Mm-hmm. I for example my background intentionally is just a white wall. but I love pink. And at first my background was the rest of the room, which is very highly decorated. And I do think that was putting me in a box. It only happened once, and I realized, no, I need to switch the camera around. So that's one thing. Another thing

is just finding ways to share I am kind of out of the box that they're initially putting me in, like bringing up my research experience, like that very large scale research project I led, or explaining how yes, I can do things with my hands, working with painting, cutting, all of that, but digital as well. And just showing all those previous things that we've talked about.

How I don't just fit into one box. I can adapt, I can be a chameleon.

Quinn Harrington (26:39.429)
Makes sense.

Naila Mir (26:39.661)
Yeah, I hate being put in a box. I want to work for people who I love working with, projects I love working on, and where I can be myself, pretty much. Obviously there are organisational standards and other things that you adhere to later, but the first point is you should love who I am and I should love who's interviewing me. It's a two-way street. So if you don't like someone who's interviewing you, you might want to question that too.

Madeleine Glassford (27:05.671)
Mm-hmm.

Naila Mir (27:09.151)
Is this the place I really want to work for? Right?

Quinn Harrington (27:12.101)
Yeah, act actually I I I consider it the same because even though Naila and I aren't, you know, doing job interviews, we do interviews constantly. you know, trying to there's our girl. She she's she's getting ready for her closeup. so even though we we we're not looking for a a role within a company, we are looking for

Naila Mir (27:31.009)
Yeah, she is.

Quinn Harrington (27:41.834)
roles with or roles with a a a particular client. So we're interviewing them and they are interviewing us. And you know, for where we sit with like, you know, 25, 30 years of experience, it's like kind of like a dance. Like we don't want to come across as desperate or needy. It's kind of like dating, you know, if someone's blowing up your phone constantly, it's just like, wow, someone's thirsty, you know

Naila Mir (28:10.893)
Yeah, yeah.

Quinn Harrington (28:11.009)
doesn't really cut come off come across as a good vibe. with when you're courting, you know, a position, I think that going in with a a a set of questions that you have as well makes you feel like or makes you seem like you're not just so desperate that you'll take anything. Right?

Like it's like you wanna know about the the company's culture. what what's what's my potential career path here? what's what what are the expectations in terms of commitment? Is this you know are you guys a you know, strictly nine to five or are you you know, we're gonna be working weekends and holidays? Like tell tell me more.

You know, I wanna I wanna know, you know, as much about you as you wanna know about me.

Naila Mir (29:17.261)
When you do look for an you talked about, I want to work for an organisation or a company where there's someone who's going to mentor me, guide me, but you know, what else is important to you when you're looking for a role? know, like, is it flexibility? What else do you look for?

Madeleine Glassford (29:32.061)
Mm-hmm.

Madeleine Glassford (29:36.646)
I do look for flexibility. I do tend to prefer in person just 'cause I love the human connection. but I'm still applying to remote positions. I do normally ask about company culture. I in class learned that there were some agencies that would do full dinners or just really fun kind of travel. So now I tend to ask about that as well.

and then I also ask if there's any kind of

extra skills or other concepts that weren't necessarily listed on that job description that would help the candidate be successful and what they're sp more specifically looking for while they're selecting a position, the p person to fill the position.

Naila Mir (30:33.602)
Yeah.

Hmm, yeah. And that means you've done a bit of work and groundwork when you're interviewing. I know my sister once did some interview and she was doing an interview for someone famous in the cycling, sports thing. She had no clue who he was. She got the job in like 30 minutes or something, but then later on he goes, do you know who I am? She's like, not really. And then she Googled it and she goes, my God, he's actually really famous.

Madeleine Glassford (30:41.885)
Mm-hmm.

Naila Mir (31:03.181)
And he actually appreciated the fact that she didn't know, you know, so she came in without that biasness it's so unfamous and trying to impress she was who she was pretty much So here comes the question. We're in the we're in the Nell's narrow segment aren't we Quinn? So three to five years from now Madeline right three to five years from now as Entry-level work and design work gets automated and we know all about the AI conversation

Quinn Harrington (31:20.913)
Correct.

Naila Mir (31:33.293)
What do you think, what is worrying you about jobs, especially for entry level people or when automization comes in, what worries you about the job market for you?

Madeleine Glassford (31:49.265)
I think I'm actually seeing an increasing amount of two or three freelancers pairing up to make a separate agency that they can funnel work through and they're taking a lot of kind of like the clients out there and they're not necessarily looking to hire others. It's more of like a two or three man

specific freelance studio situation. and I think having a team and having a full agency in a studio can be extremely helpful and there's so many people to bounce around ideas with. I don't want to see the full death of a studio ever, just 'cause they're so integral and they just really help set

the tone overall and push boundaries for where creativity can go. I also see how there are less and less opening junior positions available as like you mentioned AI does take some of that grant work away. I think it would be amazing if we could keep some of those positions open.

Naila Mir (32:53.709)
you

Madeleine Glassford (33:15.11)
For designers who are willing to do the grunt work and learn just to progress in their career.

Naila Mir (33:23.341)
That makes sense. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And especially with you Quinn being in this design space, right? These are the things that we constantly think about. What's gonna be taken over, but we come to that same point. You still need a human behind everything, right? Who's ethical.

Quinn Harrington (33:23.569)
Quinn Harrington (33:38.501)
Yeah, it's just that the the things that entry level humans are doing now is different than it was a couple years ago. I'll take I'll take my my my Rachel for example. initially it was just kind of learning about our process and our people. And so we had like I don't know, sort of like a couple of weeks of training. but then

Naila Mir (33:46.86)
Yeah.

Quinn Harrington (34:08.59)
In instead of like

working on basic stuff, it it ended up being like more like, here's like a here's a project you can take on and here's how we use a combination of AI and our own creativity to work through a problem because pretty much everything we do starts with some kind of like go to market strategy.

And so that's really where Rachel kind of kicked off where I was like, all right, so, you know, you you're you're a writer and you have learned some things in school, take a stab at creating a go to market strategy. And so immediately she started you know, working in Chat GPT and and and Claude to generate these you know, strategy documents, calendars, you know, things of that nature.

And so rather than, you know, back in the old days where you're just like cutting boards and spray mounting, you know, stuff to to to to boards and just doing boring production stuff, you know, in a in a small firm, it's like we just sort of throw you right in, like, here you go. Good luck. Call me if you need me. And I I think that so yeah, that that role is is is is changing because

Naila Mir (35:29.31)
Thank

Quinn Harrington (35:38.821)
Yeah, there's still handwork that needs to be done, but so much of it is, you know, generated differently today that when it than when I was getting started. And so this leads me to my question do you feel like the flag the program has prepared you? obviously you you know, you have a great design foundation.

You know, you know, got a BFA, you've got have learned about critical thinking and things of that nature, but have they really prepared you for the job market? I wanna know because I sit on the School of Creative Arts and Letters and I raise money, you know, to send you guys to New York and to Addies and stuff like that. So I wanna know, is the program really preparing you for for what outs there what's out there and if there's so there's a something that's missing?

I want to know so I can go back and talk to the faculty and let them know what the real world assessment is, you know, for you know, here we have one of our most talented, most recent graduates. You know, why are people not beating down the door to hire this girl?

Madeleine Glassford (36:58.63)
Thank you. I do think Flagware has adequately prepared me. I did participate in lots of portfolio reviews and while I was there I talked to so many various students who were from SCAD, UF, UNF, Jacksonville University, and I would bring over my computer and we look at work and we talk about it.

So I do think, especially within our use of AI, the Flagler students definitely had a lot more experience on how to prompt and edit AI, as I personally had some assignments where it was a requirement to use AI. I could not do something by hand. I had to generate an image using AI. so I would say I am adequately prepared.

especially with how the industry is adapting AI. I know how to use Midjourney, Chat, etc. For just small gaps, I had the opportunity to freelance with a marketing agency and I was given a photo from a client where they were holding a piece of paper, took a photo of it and then asked to recreate it using

illustrator. I did not have any of those assets so I had to recreate them and I know that's how a lot of the clients tend to discuss what they want with designers or they'll send like a picture of an AI logo and it's like, Yes, I want this. Here you go. Can you just make it better? If anything, it would be fun to have an exercise or two in a class where instead of getting a full beautiful dream brief

to design something with it's just a JPEG and we have to guess what the client actually wishes.

Naila Mir (39:00.909)
Bye.

Quinn Harrington (39:02.504)
Yeah, that's more that's more reality. I'll I'll be honest with you. The direction we get sometimes is like we just before Rachel came along, I was working on this pro this thing for an apparel brand. And so it was a very significant brand identity. And so and he's working in AI, coming up with designs, sending them to me, and I'm just like, dude, this is terrible.

Stop wasting your time. It's like, trust me, you're gonna be very happy with with the the end result and ultimately he was, but some people just like to play around. You know, they just wanna feel like they just wanna feel like

Naila Mir (39:42.647)
Yeah, let me go. You're basically saying let me go through my creative process rather than give me something to start with, right? Yeah, okay. Yeah.

Quinn Harrington (39:51.609)
Yes. You know, it's just kind of like if you're writing a comms plan and you know, your client is creating a a parallel comms plan that's totally off base. You're like, stop, stop. You're you're wasting your time and you're creating confusion for us, you know.

Naila Mir (40:12.621)
you

Yeah, because you fed in the wrong things. There's certain things you need to put in there for the comms plan to make sense from an employee perspective, the culture, the behavior, all of that stuff. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I get that. I agree. Across.

Quinn Harrington (40:21.72)
Yes, exactly. huh. I was like, if you want to do it yourself, do it yourself. But I think there's a reason that you hired us.

Madeleine Glassford (40:30.491)
Mm-hmm.

Quinn Harrington (40:32.768)
Anyhow, all right, let's go across the pond. Let me press the button. Where's that one? Across the pond.

Naila Mir (40:41.953)
This one was called Design Without a Passport, which is interesting. And it's more about getting Madeline's views on stuff, right? Because I'm very international. We work with loads of organizations. But you follow Australian designers, if I'm not wrong. And what I'm really interested in to see is the differences between what you see in Australian designs versus

Quinn Harrington (40:46.446)
Yeah.

Quinn Harrington (40:51.386)
Mm-hmm.

Madeleine Glassford (40:59.897)
Mm-hmm.

Naila Mir (41:09.727)
American studios and how design comes from here. Is there a difference?

Madeleine Glassford (41:15.947)
say two big influences that Australia has that I'm really drawn to. one is the use of the way they use light and use that as

kind of just another layer to their coastal design. I love any sort of beachy aesthetic or kind of nautical infused design and a lot of the artists there are really inspired by different like me rocky terrains, sandy beaches. There's so many different nature inspired

work as well there and then the other influence would be using kind of like colors or patterns from the Aboriginal people who lived there first, kind of like our version of Native Americans here in America. it's stunning.

Naila Mir (42:26.733)
Mm-hmm.

Naila Mir (42:32.023)
that is so okay so a bit bit over my head because I'm not into design but I understand what you're talking about in terms of influences do you see different influences in American design art or have you seen anything else other than Australian design that you get inspired by?

Madeleine Glassford (42:53.155)
I do. I do get inspired by American artists as well. I would say a lot of my favorite artists do come from either Australia or America. I tend to find the work and I'm drawn to it. And then an of course it's an Australian artist. That makes sense. That's I can understand more why I was so drawn to it. like my

Naila Mir (43:11.853)
Okay.

Madeleine Glassford (43:20.149)
One of my favorite artists is Jasmine Dowling and she is a main kind of leader in Australian design that has even come to the Americas and trickled over. I saw her making these beautiful paper multimedia videos and

I think now when I scroll on my feed, I see those a lot just from various places. and I do remember a few years ago when she first started them, thinking, this is gonna be it, this is gonna be everywhere in just a bit and truth be told, it was right.

Naila Mir (44:07.501)
Whatever you, Quinn. Any questions from across the pond for Madeleine?

Quinn Harrington (44:11.596)
Naila Mir (44:18.849)
Otherwise I'll get into another one.

Quinn Harrington (44:21.017)
Yeah, go ahead.

Naila Mir (44:22.477)
Okay, so Madeline, we talked about this in the earlier segment, right? Because you're looking for work, but work could mean many things in many different areas. So if you're honest with yourself, do you see yourself staying in the region or are you being elsewhere like physically? Like do you see yourself being somewhere else other than America, following your passion and your love?

Madeleine Glassford (44:33.326)
Mm-hmm.

Madeleine Glassford (44:50.678)
Mm-hmm. It it might be Australia, yeah. I do have I do have a friend from Flagler who graduated a year before me and she moved to Australia. so she's like, Come on over, Madeline, I know you love it. Very it's very tempting, very tempting.

Naila Mir (44:50.795)
Is that Australia?

Naila Mir (45:08.342)
Hey.

Naila Mir (45:12.395)
That's another thing to think about now in your search.

Quinn Harrington (45:14.287)
Well, you know, Australia is a former British colony, so that would be acceptable, right, Nila?

Naila Mir (45:21.441)
Right, Quinn. So is Pakistan. So therefore, Madeline, you need to also look at Pakistan design culture, because they're so different. And if I'm in the right space, we've got something called truck art. I don't know if you've heard about truck art. So in Pakistan and India, mainly, but mainly Pakistan, you have big trucks that transport products from A to B. But they are designed in a certain way, full of color.

Madeleine Glassford (45:28.164)
I will.

Naila Mir (45:50.958)
It's got like a little bit of you know animals in there like peacocks and things really nice and I think in Australia they even created a tram in truck art as well. Have a look you might you might like it.

Quinn Harrington (46:07.747)
Yeah, when I was in India, they

Madeleine Glassford (46:08.092)
I will.

Quinn Harrington (46:13.379)
Their their concept of what they do with their vehicles is totally different. Like here in America, it's basically you got three colors, white, gray, and black. You know. There it's just like their buses are painted and they're full of decorations and it's almost like they're like like little moving houses, you know. even like utilitarian vehicles like garbage trucks and stuff like that, they're all

Naila Mir (46:30.391)
Yeah.

Quinn Harrington (46:43.159)
you know, decorated and and and you know wild and it and exotic in their their their look. It's you sh you should definitely look into that. it it

Naila Mir (46:56.609)
Yeah, yeah, there's clothes as well. And now there's, you know, cutlery in that design. And if you go back into like the history, you'll see the history coming from Persian times and each region has its own artwork. I can go on forever. I've got some of it on my clothes right now. The color. I love color. But yes, so let's take you across the pond to other places. I'll share it with you offline. All right, cool. All right.

Madeleine Glassford (47:21.248)
Okay.

Quinn Harrington (47:22.285)
Yes. Very good. All right. Should we move to the future? The future. Okay, so we're at the part of the show that I've been saving. We call it the future segment, and we ask us to imagine forward not three to five years, but fifteen to twenty. So crystal ball time, I hope you brought yours, Madeline. so

Naila Mir (47:26.647)
Let's do it.

Naila Mir (47:45.708)
You

Quinn Harrington (47:48.278)
And again, I'm just asking you to speculate because none of us have the answer. Fifteen to years from twenty years from now, has the has the industry actually built a place for a creative with your range? Or has it just gotten more sophisticated about people who are specialists?

Madeleine Glassford (48:08.442)
Do you think range will continue to grow in the want for range? As I'm applying for jobs, a lot of the descriptions are looking for graphic designer who is also the whole marketing team, who is also the whole video team, who's kind of can fill all creative positions. So I do think that will increase. especially with clients asking to the designer to use AI and using that as a

Well I don't need two people now if you can take care of it with some technological assistance. So I do think it will be designers need to keep adding more and more skills to their arsenal to stay competitive.

Quinn Harrington (48:54.403)
Yeah, definitely. So we talk a lot about on AI in this show and we've had some pretty impressive guests who like like I think I know a lot, but compared to some of our guests, I'm like, I don't know shit. So we're just we're just baby stepping into this and they're building entire businesses, you know, from soup to nuts, all agentic. And so I feel like that

Naila Mir (49:09.901)
You

Quinn Harrington (49:24.055)
The the need to have a variety of experience going into the future is gonna really help you. I mean, because even if you're a prompt engineer, understanding what makes photography good, what makes illustration good, what makes for a good communications plan, understanding those different disciplines and having a real clear perspective, like a real clear aesthetic.

I think it's just gonna be absolutely critical going forward because it's the three of us in this room who decides what is good. Right? You know, because AI can spit out a hundred logo designs, but you the the person off the street might point and say, Well, I kinda like that one. But we're the one that has done the research and understands, you know, the the the brief and you know, has these de you know, well, you'll eventually have decades of experience, but

Naila Mir (50:03.309)
Mm.

Naila Mir (50:08.535)
day.

Quinn Harrington (50:23.942)
having having the aesthetic to say this works for this reason. one of my colleagues just got a a project for a new sub shop that is opening up and wasn't really anything particularly wrong with the logo until they took it and tried to get it embroidered and they're like we can't embroider this

It's like the lines in this logo are way too fine. There's no way we can embroider this. And so, yeah, I looked at it and I was like, Yeah, well, could have told you that if you had not gotten it done you know, over the internet by Fiverr, you know, for 50 bucks. You know, we can fix it, but it's not gonna be 50 bucks, I promise you.

Naila Mir (51:10.679)
Yeah.

Yeah, you talk about using judgment, right? When we talk about AI and we're helping a client with AI and embedding it, we tell them it's about being, yes, you can use it, but you have to be ethical, make sure you know what you're putting in there in terms of sensitive information, be responsible, and use your judgment because that AI tool can't do it. In fact, Quinn, now you're talking about it, Madeleine might even come up with a product in the future.

Quinn Harrington (51:19.374)
Mm-hmm.

Naila Mir (51:42.795)
Who knows? It might not be a job.

Madeleine Glassford (51:44.419)
Mm-hmm.

Quinn Harrington (51:46.446)
Well, she's got some product in the works. It's so you know, so secret squirrel she doesn't even wanna tell us what it is, you know. So

Naila Mir (51:49.949)
yes.

Naila Mir (51:54.348)
Let's not. Let's not. Protect the IP here. Like, yes. But we will hear about it.

Quinn Harrington (52:00.523)
Well, when you when you do roll it out, we want to have you back on the program. Absolutely.

Madeleine Glassford (52:00.534)
That's what I'm hoping for.

Thank you. Yes, it is a continuation of my thesis project. So all my research will be put to good use.

Naila Mir (52:04.779)
Yes.

Quinn Harrington (52:12.312)
Very good.

Naila Mir (52:12.461)
Good, good. We look forward to that.

Quinn Harrington (52:15.458)
All right, so moving to my quintessential close, Madeline, ten years from now, where do you want to be standing and what's the piece of work you most want to have made that you haven't made yet?

Madeleine Glassford (52:31.909)
I do think it would be amazing to have my own agency in fit that time period. I also hope to have my pro my product will be released by then. I'm I'm very excited to can just continue that. I really look forward to just creating a bunch of work that makes me happy and feel fulfilled and keeps

Naila Mir (52:47.383)
Good one.

Madeleine Glassford (53:00.333)
helping me grow creatively and keeps pushing me and I get to work with others who are just as enthused about it as I am. Just 'cause design and art they're my passions and I'm so lucky that I'm going into an industry where I get to do what I'm passionate about every day.

Quinn Harrington (53:21.186)
Well said.

Madeleine Glassford (53:22.743)
Thank you.

Naila Mir (53:24.843)
Now I'm thinking of more branches out. Connection, this is all about connection. My friend who we hoping to bring onto this podcast, Quinn, who's a spoken, you call it spoken poet, what do you call spoken words? And he's writing his third book. So we have to obviously wait for him to get done with the third book and he's done with his press. You could be designing, like designing for his books in the future. Who knows what collaborations can come out of.

Quinn Harrington (53:32.696)
Mm-hmm.

Quinn Harrington (53:37.614)
Spoken word? Yeah.

Naila Mir (53:53.687)
Connections, right? Yeah. I will keep you in mind if I have to refer you.

Madeleine Glassford (53:54.989)
Mm-hmm.

Thank you.

Quinn Harrington (53:58.691)
Yes, that's Nyla is the name of her company is P three Connect. Connecting people with purpose, passion, and people, purpose and passion. Yep.

Naila Mir (54:02.733)
Yes.

and

That's it. Yeah, people with passion and purpose and our principles are collaborating, connecting on meaningful work and contributing to the greater good. Yeah. So are we going? Shall we go? Madeline, before you wrap up, for someone who is listening right now and who's living in their own version of the gaps that you're seeing, what's the one thing you'd like to tell them?

Quinn Harrington (54:23.874)
Very good. Let's go to the rap.

Madeleine Glassford (54:39.959)
I would say continue to network and continue to get better. I'm playing I found some graphic design games online where I can keep learning how to perfect my skills. and there are so many resources out there as well to continue that. And then I'm also going back and visiting all those connections I made in school, going to reviews

reaching out to those people, asking to take another peek at my portfolio, if they know anybody hiring. And I've had some really amazing calls of people taking time out of their day and they go through the projects with me. And it's been absolutely fantastic because I love any sort of feedback. so just continue to learn and put yourself out there.

Naila Mir (55:35.063)
Great. I like that. Okay.

Quinn Harrington (55:37.832)
And tell us again where we can find your work.

Madeleine Glassford (55:42.689)
MadelineGlassford dot com and then I'm Madeline.glassford on Instagram, Madeline Glassford on LinkedIn. Everywhere it's Madeline Glassford.

Quinn Harrington (55:53.806)
And that's for our listeners, A D E L E I N E G L L A S G L A S S F O R D.

Madeleine Glassford (56:04.035)
Mm-hmm, thank you.

Naila Mir (56:05.975)
I connected with you on LinkedIn already, Madeline. All right.

Madeleine Glassford (56:08.705)
Amazing.

Quinn Harrington (56:11.886)
well, thank you so much for joining us, Madeline. And that wraps up this episode of Now Near in the Future. You can find us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your podcasts. You can also watch us on YouTube. And I look forward to get us going on Apple video podcasts here pretty soon when we figure out how to do that. You can find us at Now Near in the Future.

Madeleine Glassford (56:19.788)
Is it

Quinn Harrington (56:41.29)
At now near in the future on all of our social handles and at and now near future dot com.

Naila Mir (56:49.805)
And if this one stayed with you share it with someone who's standing in their own gap or reach out to Madeline if you find that you can work with her

Quinn Harrington (56:56.287)
Absolutely.

pitch is a delightful young woman and I think I I give her two thumbs up.

Naila Mir (57:07.755)
Yay, I'm gonna go follow your work now, yes, Madeline? Alright, cool.

Madeleine Glassford (57:10.423)
Yes, thank you so much for having me. It was so fun.

Quinn Harrington (57:13.428)
As always, stay curious and keep dreaming.

Naila Mir (57:15.851)
Thank you and we will see you in the future.